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主题:【原创】比亚迪的电动汽车神话 -- 同人于野

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    • 家园 铁电池对环境的影响比铅酸电池小吗?
    • 家园 看看SMART CAR电动版的性能吧,这可是已在市场上的车子阿

      We’d like to introduce you to a car that’s designed to bring a breath of fresh air to the streets: the refreshingly new smart electric vehicle – or smart ed, as we call it. It’s the natural product of smart’s unswerving commitment to the environment and innovation – not to mention fun. It isn’t available to buy just yet, but it isn’t a million miles off. Think of a smart. Then think of an electric socket concealed behind what used to be the fuel cap. Picture the complete absence of exhaust fumes, so no CO2 emissions from the rear. Close your eyes and hear… no sound at all coming from the engine. Imagine no engine oil, no road tax, and no London congestion charge and you’ll start to get a sense of what really makes the new smart ed tick. Powered solely by electricity, and chargeable from any three-pin socket the smart ed can achieve the equivalent of 300 mpg – that amounts to a saving of up to 80% in fuel costs over the already highly economical smart fortwo. The ev can travel up to 72 miles between charges, which typically take around 8 hours for a full charge – ideal for charging at work between your morning and evening commutes. If your journey takes you into the capital, you will find free electricity provided by some London boroughs, as well as free or discounted parking. With a top-up charge during the day, the smart ed’s daily range weighs in at 100 miles. With that in mind, we’re running a market trial with selected blue chip companies who are happy to meet our requirements to power the cars using only renewable energy sources. When we say zero emissions, we really mean it! Among the partners already enrolled in the trial are The Energy Saving Trust, Islington and Coventry Councils, Foster & Partners, CarbonNeutral Company, EDF Energy and Amey. What’s more, our ed hasn’t had to sacrifice any of the fortwo’s performance or class-leading equipment: expect the full complement of Mercedes-Benz safety features and a top speed of 70 mph courtesy of a powerful Zytek electric motor. Once it’s up to speed (0-30mph in an impressive 6.5 seconds) the ev uses its tiny weight gain to deliver an exciting and stable drive. So there you have it: a zero emission vehicle that is 100% smart; a car that will save money and the environment. Although the smart ed won’t be available to the public just yet, it’s definitely something we’re working on. What’s more, towards the end of 2007, customers will be able to try it out at Mercedes-Benz World, Brooklands. We’ll be interested to hear what you think.

    • 家园 【文摘】Paper battery

      Paper battery offers future power

      The black piece of paper can power a small light

      Flexible paper batteries could meet the energy demands of the next generation of gadgets, says a team of researchers.

      They have produced a sample slightly larger than a postage stamp that can release about 2.3 volts, enough to illuminate a small light.

      But the ambition is to produce reams of paper that could one day power a car.

      Professor Robert Linhardt, of the Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, said the paper battery was a glimpse into the future of power storage.

      The team behind the versatile paper, which stores energy like a conventional battery, says it can also double as a capacitor capable of releasing sudden energy bursts for high-power applications.

      While a conventional battery contains a number of separate components, the paper battery integrates all of the battery components in a single structure, making it more energy efficient.

      Integrated devices

      The research appears in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS).

      "Think of all the disadvantages of an old TV set with tubes," said Professor Linhardt, from the New York-based institute, who co-authored a report into the technology.

      "The warm up time, power loss, component malfunction; you don't get those problems with integrated devices. When you transfer power from one component to another you lose energy. But you lose less energy in an integrated device."

      You can implant a piece of paper in the body and blood would serve as an electrolyte

      Professor Robert Linhardt

      The battery contains carbon nanotubes, each about one millionth of a centimetre thick, which act as an electrode. The nanotubes are embedded in a sheet of paper soaked in ionic liquid electrolytes, which conduct the electricity.

      The flexible battery can function even if it is rolled up, folded or cut.

      Although the power output is currently modest, Professor Linhardt said that increasing the output should be easy.

      "If we stack 500 sheets together in a ream, that's 500 times the voltage. If we rip the paper in half we cut power by 50%. So we can control the power and voltage issue."

      Because the battery consists mainly of paper and carbon, it could be used to power pacemakers within the body where conventional batteries pose a toxic threat.

      "I wouldn't want the ionic liquid electrolytes in my body, but it works without them," said Professor Linhardt. "You can implant a piece of paper in the body and blood would serve as an electrolyte."

      But Professor Daniel Sperling at University of California, Davis, an expert on alternative power sources for transport, is unconvinced.

      'More difficult'

      "Batteries and capacitors are being steadily improved, but electricity storage is much more difficult and expensive than liquid fuels and probably will be so forever," he said.

      "The world is not going to change as a result of this new invention any time soon."

      Professor Linhardt admitted that the new battery is still some way from the commercial market.

      "The devices we're making are only a few inches across. We would have to scale up to sheets of newspaper size to make it commercially viable," he said. But at that scale, the voltage could be large enough to power a car, he said.

      However, carbon nanotubes are very expensive, and batteries large enough to power a car are unlikely to be cost effective.

      "I'm a strong enthusiast of electric vehicles, but it is going to take time to bring the costs down," said Professor Sperling.

      But Professor Linhardt said integrated devices, like the paper battery, were the direction the world was moving.

      "They are ultimately easier to manufacture, more environmentally friendly and usable in a wide range of devices," he said.

      The ambition is to produce the paper battery using a newspaper-type roller printer.

    • 家园 【文摘】GM Eyes Electric Car

      GM Eyes Electric Car Initiative -FT

      132 words

      13 August 2007

      5:57:00 AM GMT

      Dow Jones International News

      English

      (c) 2007 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.

      LONDON (Dow Jones)-- General Motors Corp (GM) may allow buyers of its Chevy Volt electric car to rent the vehicle's battery as a way of pricing the vehicle at a comparable level to a traditional, petrol-driven family sedan, reports the Financial Times Monday.

      The Volt is emerging as one of the most crucial vehicles in GM's history - failure would be a deep embarrassment after the fanfare surrounding its development, the report says. But success could propel GM past Toyota Corp (TM) as a pioneer in alternative energy vehicles, and GM has assigned 150 engineers to the project, according to the report.

    • 家园 感觉有点忽悠的意思,广告成分居多
    • 家园 太神奇了吧,如果真行,按加拿大的价格基本买了车就不用花钱了

      一度电 7 分, 15 度就是85 分,一块不到。现在汽油100公里10升,价格 10块多。

      感觉真行的不会那么提前报料吧。

    • 家园 振奋人心!新产品一般总是要经过一些波折的,希望比亚迪好运!

    • 家园 【原创】一点讨论

      鄙人供职于此公司,对此铁电池的性能有所了解。铁电池有广泛的应用,可以在相当大部分领域取代铅酸等种类的蓄电池,电动汽车只是其中之一,在此回答朋友们的一些疑问:

      不知道铁电池的寿命怎么样? 辛亥 2007-08-10 01:23:04

      不知道铁电池的寿命怎么样?如果可充放电的次数太少,比如一两百次。那么全电车的使用成本就还是太高了。无论如何都是好消息!

      常温充放电循环次数在千次以上。

      不知道他要用的电池有多重 橡树村 2007-08-10 22:28:48

      电池的单个电压都不高,要输出上百伏电压,需要一大堆呢。

      几十个串联,与铅酸相比的话,不算太重。

      电动汽车出身的科技部长万钢的看法 大黄 2007-08-10 06:14:27

      电动汽车是个大系统,斗胆猜测万部长当时关注的可能不在电池,尤其是新型电池上。

      人就是个大忽悠! 末三马甲 2007-08-10 09:29:42

      电池车到今天,最大的问题不是容量/安全,是全寿/价格!Prius最大的问题就不是电池的容量而是电池的寿命/价格,1K刀的电池保8年大家已经觉得是个问题了,BYD他那个电池,容量10倍于prius,每次充放电的深度更是远大于Prius,那么他要多少钱一个?可以充多少个循环?开多久就得换一个?我深信最后算下来每公里的成本就完全两样了.他要能做到电池一个能用10万迈价格却只有2000刀,车出来俺第一个买,问题是,可能吗?

      OMG!他还吹他的10分钟充70%的超快充!这样的充法电池能有多少寿命!玩这种忽悠人的态度!F

      另外一个可能的忽悠:百公里15度,容量300公里就是45度,充电效率50%(充电都有电源转换损耗和过电压损耗的,这已经是不低的效率了)的情况下, 家庭用10小时慢充的电流是40A!家里装50A的电表,小区和街道的电线也能负担的地方我实在不了解,自己觉得是忽悠,大家有知道的请扫盲.

      铁电池作为一种新型二次电池,与prius所使用的镍氢电池相比具有很多的性能优点,更重要的是,目前铁电池具有相当大的成本下降空间,随着扩大产业化,两年之后的价格会比现在低廉得多,届时欢迎您购买。10分钟充电70%的容量,相当于6C充电,偶尔为之,对寿命影响不大,实际上,这种快充也是需要专用设备的支持的。10小时慢充的充电电流会大大低于您估计的40A。

      作为企业家,在新技术的宣传上趋利避害是很正常的。语焉不详,自然难免尖锐的质疑。但铁电池的电动汽车应用目前技术层面已无大的障碍,之所以锁定两年后,也是因为有信心在两年内将现存但非致命性的问题解决,从而实现真正意义上的纯电动汽车大规模应用。BYD已经颠覆了二次可充电电池行业,也并非不可能在电动汽车甚至汽车行业内搅它个天翻地覆,朋友们不妨拭目以待。

      • 家园 请教一个问题

        “两年之后的价格会比现在低廉得多”

        现在铁电池的单位AH容量的价格是多少?两年后预计是多少?依据是什么?

        电动汽车的致命问题就是电池问题,但电池问题包括价格、容量、重量、可靠性等都解决了,这样的电池的市场远不仅仅是电动汽车,其它领域的收益恐怕会远远大于做电动汽车了,所以这才是更值得关注的地方。

      • 家园 如果是这样,我这个坚定的步行族,也要买车了!
      • 家园 最好专贴介绍介绍这个铁电池如何?

        也给大家普及普及~

      • 家园 如果是真的,可能是四大发明以后中国对人类的最大贡献,

        王选那个实际上只算做到了和国外的类似产品同步。汽车工业从亨利福特以后没人做过这么大的进步吧,这老兄叫王传福,真的是福特的传人:)

        一般从白手起家的企业家口中来的话比从所谓的官员和专家口中的话要可靠的多! 我虽然还是心有怀疑,但最近几天期货市场的油价确实跌势凶猛,不知道是否有关。如果油价一年再跌40%,那多半与此有关。

      • 家园 内行来了!好!
      • 家园 请教一下铁电池的问题

        一个是寿命,按您的说法快速充电还是对寿命不利的,下面是去年的一个报道,现在这些指标是否有变化,是否能更准确一些?

        外链出处

        提到充电,可能多数人会问及电池的寿命。官方介绍,铁电池可以循环充、放电2000次,每次充电时间在10分钟左右即可达到70%的充电量。如果按照300km的续航里程来算,折合行驶里程应为60万km,即使以出租车的使用强度,使用周期应在5年左右。那么由此引申的一个疑问,随着累计的使用、电池频繁充放电导致的电解液稀释,他的寿命是否也会受到影响?百公里的电量消耗又是多少?行驶中是否会有噪音产生?对此官方称:“之所以给出2000次的充放电数量,是在综合了以上情况下给出的保守数值。F3e的百公里电量消耗为12度,在行驶过程中在车内基本感受不到噪音,只有在发动机盖开启的状态下,可以隐约听见电动机的工作声音以及随之产生的震动”。

        第二个是这个铁电池具体是什么电池,比如是磷酸铁锂电池吗?网上有这样的传闻

        外链出处

        比亚迪所说的铁电池是磷酸铁锂电池还是高铁电池

        根据比亚迪所说的铁电池概念,其结构示意图如上。它应该是电池领域的新星:高铁电池或超铁电池,它是一种新型可充电电池,与普通高能电池相比,该电池能长时间保持稳定的放电电压,而且比功率(W/Kg)较高。

        比亚迪所说的铁电池,我在国电电力论坛上的一个朋友,叫做USER,他曾经问过比亚迪的总工,实际上还是锂电池

        第三,这个铁电池的专利情况怎么样,什么时间会公开?

        外链出处

         王传福:现在这个铁电池是铁定了,具备量产的能力,我们在不同的产品开始使用这个铁电池,公司购买了一平方公里的地,开始建大楼造这个产品,我们现在是在上海造,我们准备移到深圳,这个产品现在非常成熟,我们现在就等待汽车研发,等待专业在全球的公开。我们有一个发明专利,公开期18个月,比如今天申请了,18个月才会公开,我们现在在等待这一些手续,这一些过程。我今天很高兴的告诉大家一个信号,铁电池已经是OK 了,我们下面的步骤就是时间问题。

        关键词(Tags): #比亚迪#铁电池
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